Hey everybody, welcome back to The Covenant Eyes Podcast. We are really excited about today's episode. We have a really fun guest with a lot of wisdom, a lot of energy, and a great story to share with us. We have Kristen Clark joining us, and she is with a ministry called Girl Defined, and it is a great conversation. We actually had her sister on I've like a month or so ago, and the two of them are just amazing women doing some great stuff in the church. Kristen, thank you so much for for joining us today. Thanks for having me, Karen. I'm excited for this conversation. Yeah. So for those that might not know your story and your ministry, would you just kind of share a little bit about what got you started in this ministry and, your passion for helping women? Yeah. So like you said, my sister Bethany and I started Girl Define together about ten years ago. And our passion from the beginning was just to help our generation and the next generation of women understand God's design for their womanhood. So we always say, the one who designed you is the one who defines you. And you know, as a woman, it's so easy and as a man. But our ministry is for women to to find our identity in everything but who God says we are and his plan and good design for us. So trying to bring a biblical understanding to the relevant issues of today, from everything to relationships to sexuality to femininity to success, our purpose in life, just everything that has to do with womanhood, understanding it through the lens of Scripture and then allowing God to define us and then in turn, finding freedom and flourishing. And that I love that, that, you know, in our culture, like the message of what is a woman gets so lost in the conversation, not to be cynical at all, but I mean, honestly, you know, I feel for the younger generation because they're really, you know, not being given good, sound biblical training sometimes, especially if they're online all the time on social media, because the images and the things that they're seeing are defining women in a way that is actually not God honoring. So let's talk a little bit about, you know, you've talked openly about your past struggles with sexual sin and that journey. And certainly I think that would be a good place to kind of start so that our listeners can really relate to the fact that you've been there before and you you really had to lean into God and learn, what he had in store for you and your life. Yeah. So going back in time. I grew up as a believer. I'm an 80s baby, but, you know, really grew up in the 90s and grew up in a lot of the purity culture movement, which in so many ways I am thankful for a lot of it, for, just a lot of the discipleship that I received and understanding a lot about God's design for purity and pursuing that and the importance of that, the value of that. But one of the dishes that I fell into as a young Christian woman was having sexual struggles, but being too afraid or scared to speak about them openly, to share, because I felt like, okay, I am called to be this pure woman. I need to be this godly Christian woman. I had younger women looking up to me. I'm the oldest of five sisters. So I felt this putting it on myself. This pressure of I need to look the part. Even though I'm struggling on the inside. I can't let anybody know about that. So some of the stories that I've shared openly, even in our book,“Sex, Purity, and the Longings of a Girl's Heart”, that my sister and I co-authored together, I share very openly a lot of my journey of wrestling with what I call secret sin of struggling with, habitual masturbation. And that was very fantasy driven, very lust driven for me and my heart. Just lust on a general level, just struggling and not really knowing how to get out of this. I was way too ashamed to tell anybody about it. I really felt like I needed to keep up that image of the pure Christian girl. And it wasn't until multiple years into my struggle, probably my later teens, I heard a Christian speaker talking very openly about sexual struggles at this conference, and it was the first time I had ever heard anybody talking about masturbation specifically, and just some of the pitfalls that it can have for us as as anybody, as young people, just a disordered understanding of God's good design for intimacy. And I had never heard that. And for the first time, I felt so convicted, and I realized, I need to get honest about this. I have been hiding this for years. I have not told a single person I am so ashamed. And one of the first steps they encouraged us to do. As if you're struggling, be honest, tell someone and if you feel like you can, tell your parents if they're believers and that's a safe place for you to go do that. And I remember making that decision then in there that I was going to be open and honest and confessed to my parents the struggle and ask them for prayer and help. And it was the scariest thing I've ever done. And I know some people listening might be like, what? Like masturbation? You're a teen like, that's not a big deal. At that time in my life, it was it was huge. And I made that choice to tell my parents. And again, it was the hardest thing I've ever done. But I'm telling you, on the other side of that conversation, they were so gracious. They prayed with me, received my you confession with open arms. And they were like, we want to walk with you and help you. That was the beginning of my journey toward not only freedom from that habitual sin struggle that I had wrestled with for years, but beginning my journey of really understanding what it means to walk in purity. As a Christian, where we are imperfect, we struggle. We have temptation. But what it looks like to do that in community, not in isolation. Inviting other people, trusted people, mentors, people who are godly are older than us into our struggles and saying, would you come alongside me in this and not wrestling alone? So for me, that was the biggest turning point was when I got open and honest and invited others to help me in my struggle. That's awesome. And so many of our listeners really can relate to that, because that really is like the gates will just open right up when we step into that vulnerability and share our struggles in that way. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. And thank you for being vulnerable with your story. You know, from that, you know, from that experience and then your growth and sanctification in the Lord. You then kind of rolled into this ministry Girl Defined. So talk to us like what led you to to create this ministry? Because now you're you're coaching women about womanhood and and being a mom and being a wife and all the things. So how did you get there? Well, when we started it, I was probably mid 20s and I saw so many of the next generation struggling with pretty much everything that I had struggled with and looking for answers. And these young women were basically like they are today. But at the time going online and looking for answers online. So Google searching every last struggle that they had. And my sister and I thought, wow, we have wrestled with so many of these things. We're still growing in our understanding of God's design for womanhood. But what if we come alongside of these younger women as mentors in a sense, and encourage them in their walk with Christ, in their understanding of God's design, and provide answers online that are biblically based and not just, you know, these girls coming across who knows what cosmopolitan article and then taking that advice. So we put ourselves out there. We started blogging and then it turned into YouTube and then eventually a podcast and a couple books. The publisher found us, and it's just a cool story that God just kept opening these doors. But really, our passion was wanting to be mentors to the next generation. And as we just started dipping our toe into this and writing these, you know, back then, blogging was the thing we received email after email from young women who were saying, I have struggled with the same thing, and especially when it comes to sexual struggles, those are the ones that stand out to me the most, because I cannot tell you how many emails we received and still do from young women and women who will email us, and the subject line will literally say, help! I've never told anyone about this struggle, and they'll go on to share whatever sexual struggle they're wrestling with, whether it is pornography, masturbation, just addicted to reading erotica, you know, an unwholesome, unhealthy relationship. Whatever it is, we're the first ones they're telling about this, and they felt like they could because of how open we were with our struggles and our journey of trying to define every part of our lives according to God's good design. So that's what led us into it, just looking at our own lives and realizing we're all in this together, let's let's link arms and join us, you know, create a sisterhood essentially of of coming alongside these young women. And to this day, I mean, the need is so great. That is so good. And you mentioned, like, you kind of came of age in the 90s. So, you know, at that time we didn't have the internet. And so, right, you know, imagine going through those struggles, the struggles that you know, young people Gen Z are going through today with access to the internet because, you know, for my generation, you know, if you had questions that you weren't comfortable asking because I grew up in the purity culture as well, and it's like you would look to those magazines, you would ask your friends or, you know, there wasn't an internet to go to. So you're kind of limited. But now at the at everyone's fingertips, they have access to, you know, all sorts of information and a lot of it is not biblically sound. So how does that impact the next generation, and how do you think that's changing? You know, especially with pornography, how women are getting lured into pornography because, you know, they may just be looking for answers, but end up getting sucked into pornography because of it's addictive nature. Oh my goodness, I have such a love hate relationship with technology. I'm sure you feel the same. Like, yeah, the benefits that come from it and then the pitfalls and you just see these young women like you're saying they I think a lot of them are naive in some ways, just getting on all of these platforms. Oh, my friend is on this. My friend is on that. So they join these different social media platforms or, you know, dating apps or whatever it is. And before they know it, they're hooked into all sorts of, just terrible stuff. And so much of it is just so promiscuous and so pornographic. And what used to be shocking, you know, back when I was young, is just kind of normal, kind of mainstream now for what young people are exposed to. So the need for young women to understand that pornography is not normal. Okay. It may be common, but it is not good. It is not wholesome. It is not right for your heart, for your mind. It is warping your perspective about so many things regarding what true intimacy is. What God designed sex for, who he designed it to be between your own body. Female beauty. I mean, it's impacting, I think every aspect of a woman's perspective about womanhood, about sexuality, about what it means to embrace relationships rightly. There's so much distortion, and it's just happening kind of low key in the background in everything they do. Because you, you see a group of young people out, you know, they're at a coffee shop, they're at a restaurant, they're not talking. They're all on their phones, which I think is so sad. So we're losing even that relational component of knowing how to how to have relationships, healthy relationships. So we have shifted our messaging at Girl Defined quite a bit as we've seen, the impact of social media, of technology, of every person having this, the world in their pocket, essentially on their phone with access to things like pornography so easily, we have targeted more specific topics trying to address some of this and really help women. And I think a lot of young women just feel like they're drowning. They don't know how to come up for air. They just feel like they're drowning. And that's why I think we get so many of those emails just cries for help, saying, I don't know what to do, please help me. That's so good. Well, you know, you have a book that you put together. And it was made to be she reclaiming God's plan for fearless femininity. So I want to talk a little bit about that book. Because I think that's such an important conversation and so many people really need to get wisdom in this area because, you know, you you've already said it. I mean, the culture is feeding us all sorts of lies, and it is so hard for our young women to navigate. You know, you see all these trends on Instagram, like being a trad wife is the right thing to do or being a business, you know, go into the business world and be your own. You know, woman, you don't need a man. Like there are mixed messages coming at our, our youth. And so I'm guessing that your book hopes to kind of address some of those things. So talk to us a little bit about the book and how it can help young women. Yeah. Made to be she reclaiming God's plan for fearless femininity are passion and hope. And writing this was to try to thread that needle of not swinging to one end of the pendulum, where we're now tapping our toe into legalism and creating our own version of womanhood, but then not swinging so far to the other side, where we're really presenting a worldly version of womanhood that's, you know, girl-boss and you don't need a man. And so much of what the feminists push for, we were like, how do we write this book and really just present what the Bible teaches? And no more like no more, no less like, what does the Bible actually say? So I'm telling you, it was hard. It was a really hard, book to write because of that. But it forced my sister and I to really dig in to God's Word and to really evaluate truly, genuinely, what does he say? What does he not say? And we realize in our own lives that we had gone astray in some key areas of, I think adopting mindsets that were good but not necessarily explicitly stated in Scripture regarding our womanhood and then other mindsets that we realized, ooh, we really have picked up a lot on culture's messaging regarding what it means to be successful, or what it means to be beautiful, and really having to go back to God's Word and genuinely evaluate, like, what does he say? So we camp a lot in passages like Proverbs 31, which I know, you know, some women roll their eyes, others are like, oh my goodness, the unattainable woman. But really just taking a genuine look of saying, okay, Lord, you gave us this passage. This woman, who is she? What is she about? What can we learn from her? Titus two obviously talks about important things that God wants older women to teach younger women and so many of those things about, for married women, you know, loving your husbands, being keepers of the home, valuing your children, serving others like things that aren't necessarily messages we're hearing from in society. We see that God has a very different value system than what we get from culture. So we just try to really unpack Scripture. We look at Genesis, we take a really hard look in God's initial creation of the male and female and the distinctions there. We have some beautiful chapters called Made to be he and she, where we unpack what was this creation order, where we see God creating the man first, giving him responsibilities, roles, purpose, identity in his masculinity. And then in Genesis two, we see God creating the second creature after the man. And she's a counterpart. She's different, but she's complementary. She's this beautiful female that has a different physical design, physical capabilities, different hormones. All of that was there right at the moment of creation. And then God brings her to the woman as a helper. And they're a team. They are in this perfect marriage where there's no sin. Yet in Genesis two, and we see this incredible complementary design of the male and the female, and there's so much that we can learn from that. I think we tend to brush over it like, oh, Genesis two, you been there, read it, you know, no big deal. But there is so much that we can learn from God's intention for manhood and womanhood the male, the female, the husband, the wife, just from Genesis two. And then, of course, sin happened and distorted everything and twisted and warped our desires, which is the world that we live in today. So I think in our hearts we have this natural push against God's design because of sin, but humbly coming to the table and saying, okay, Lord, what do you have for my womanhood? What do you reveal in Genesis? What do you value in Titus two and Proverbs 31? And having an open handedness like just the picture I love to, visualize even for myself, is just taking your palms and opening your hands up and saying, God, your will, your way, your design, not mine. And just that surrender nurse, that heart posture that says again, you're my designer, so you're my definer. You created me. You know what's best for me. Your plan is actually for my good and my flourishing. Your design, your boundaries, your order. You aren't against me. You are for me. And it's. It's my sin. It's my flesh. It's my heart that pushes against you. So help me to surrender and embrace your design. To walk in it. Because you are a good creator and I know your ways and your plans and your designs are also good. Most people don't know how to measure whether porn is a problem. Well, now you can. Hi, I'm Mike Stone, producer of The Covenant Eyes Podcast. At Covenant Eyes , we have created a short, free and confidential assessment called the P.A.U.S. Test. That's Porn Addiction Use Severity. It's not about judgment. It's about understanding. So in just a few minutes, you'll get clarity on where you stand and what your next step could be. So take the free test now at cvnteyes.co/test. That's cvnteyes.co/test. Super short. Super simple. Now you've got nothing to lose and everything to gain. Now back to the show. You know, it is funny because we do skate over the Genesis, the creation story so many times because we don't want that to be the case, often because culture is, you know, it's telling us like, oh, we're equals. And, you know, you can do anything a man can do. And it's like God has actually designed us to be unique and different, to support one another in special ways. And I think that's an area that, you know, as a woman and I work, and so I'm out in the, you know, the world. My kids are grown now. But, you know, I did have a job when my kids were in school. And so, you know, I had to find a way to balance that, like, ensure that I was aligned with God's calling for my life and that he wanted me to do this work and and to be a mom and still take care of the home and support my husband and do all these things. But it it's an interesting dynamic because the messaging out there is just so counter-culture to what the Bible says. So talk to us a little bit. You have other books out there too, and I think you've got some interesting ones that are, I think there's one called “Sex, Purity and the Longings of a Girl's Heart”. So that one, you know, I definitely want to dive into that one as well. What's that one about? And what could our listeners take away from that book? Well, what the title says, right. It's about sex, purity and the longings of a girl's heart. We actually before we wrote that book, we surveyed 500 women from our community that were a girl to find followers and ask them, what do you want us to talk about when it comes to sex and purity? What are you struggling with? What are those questions that you're too afraid to ask anybody that you've never voiced? What are the struggles that you're facing in your own life? What are some of the the sinful habits you find yourself in that you've never told anyone about? And we had 500 women respond, and it was incredible and very insightful to hear from a variety of women from all over the world, from singleness to married teens, your 20s, 30s, 40s. It really helped us create the outline for this book. We wanted to talk about the things that these women wanted us to address, and so that really, like I said, created the outline for it. And we we did not shy away from any topics. We just went straight for the jugular, you know, diving into and I know this is normal everyday work for you, talking about things like pornography, masturbation, erotica, the secret struggles, just lust and not only presenting the problems, but how do we find freedom from these things? My sister and I each have different journeys, sharing very openly and honestly about that, talking about how lust is not just a man's problem. I know for a lot of women in the survey, they said, I feel like I'm the only woman who struggles with this. Nobody in my church talks about this. It's only presented as a man's issue. And men need the the small groups and the Bible studies and the help. But the women are just kind of left out to dry. So women would say, I'm scared to even talk to anybody because I feel like they're going to think I'm really weird for even struggling with pornography or whatever it was. So for women to realize they're not the only ones. This is a sin struggle that is common to man. It's not man as in men, but to mankind, for men and women and for women to realize, okay, I'm not the only one. God does care about this. He did create me to be a sexual being. Also, it's not just the men who were sexual and the women who were like gender neutral. Like, no, we have a gender. We have a sexual design. We have desires, passions, longings which can be good and beautiful. Sex was God's design. We unpack his entire design for it. Our longings for intimacy and really trying to show women that so often we have these these desires for sexual you, these sex drives and different things. And we especially in singleness, we tend to look to all the wrong places to find it, not realizing, wow, I was created as a sexual being, but my deepest longing ultimately is to be in a relationship with my creator and my Savior. So we talk about that word, yada, that Old Testament word that we see in Scripture where it's this deep knowing and how God created us to have this deep and intimate knowing with him first and foremost. But yet we try to find that in so many other ways that are sinful, that are contrary to God's design. So really helping women see one. Your sexual design is a good and beautiful thing too. It has been distorted by sin and our desires are warped and sin bent. So how do we redeem that? Through the power and the grace of Christ through the gospel? How do we find redemption in that, and then pursue it rightly and find our satisfaction ultimately in a relationship with Christ? And then from there in the right context within marriage, enjoy some of these beautiful gifts that he's given us to experience sexual pleasure. That's amazing. I love that you guys take on these tough topics. Head up to your ministry. We love. There's not enough out there. I imagine one day a church where, you know, these kind of conversations can happen. I know, you know, more regularly in women's programs because, yeah, this is an issue that definitely doesn't get discussed. And let's talk about the church for a minute, because, you know, it's a covenant as we work with lots of churches and, you know, we, you know, shared the Barna stats, Barna just released some new stats on, you know, the number of women struggling with pornography. Christian women is up to 44% now. I mean, that's a pretty staggering number. And there are, very few, if any, women's centered programs in churches. Just talking about, you know, biblical sexuality and just answering the tough questions, let alone pornography itself. So what can the church be doing to better support women in this way? Because I think there are a lot of women with a lot of questions. And really, the church should be the place to get answers, you know, the obviously biblically centered answers. But we would want that to be the beacon of hope and information. Yeah, I think it starts with the leadership, right? I mean, the leaders from the leaders down, whether it's church, actual church leadership, lay leaders, small group leaders, we all need to get more honest because what happens is in churches, there tends to be this like silence around sexual struggles. But the truth is, every person has had some struggle in one way or another, whether you're the pastor or down to a small group leader, down to just your attending, your visiting. We all have wrestled with sexual sin, sexual temptation. Whether you're a man or a woman in some capacity. And so the fact that we're not talking about it at all just speaks to the fact that we are we're being silent because we're either ashamed, were fearful, we are not responding in an authentic, genuine way to the things that are truly happening in our hearts and lives. So I think from the leadership down there just needs to be more genuine openness and authenticity to say, yeah, I've wrestled with this. You know, I wrestle with pornography or I, I struggled with masturbation or I really was addicted to these certain shows on Netflix that were very sexual and not healthy for me or, you know, these women's magazines that were filling my mind with basically pornographic content in novel forms, words, whatever, getting honest. And I think it it's like a domino effect as, as some people step up to the plate, especially leadership, and get honest and open and share, then I think that will naturally trickle down to those who are in the congregation. So thankfully, and I'm sure you've seen some of this too, I feel like there is more openness now than there was maybe ten years ago, 20 years ago. I am even in my own church, seeing more honest and open conversations around this. So I think the the realization of okay, especially in this age of technology, like there are a lot of things happening, a lot of private moments in people's lives and hearts and struggles. And there is a need to address it more. So I am seeing a movement in the right direction. I think just with the increase of resources of books, I've heard of women even going through the book. My sister and I wrote,“Sex, Purity, and the Longings of a Girl's Heart” doing women's studies in their churches. And to me, that is a huge step. Like, wow, we are going straight for the meat. Like we are going there and having these conversations. So I'm encouraged by some of that, but I know it's just begun there. We need to continue. And if someone's listening and they're like, yeah, my church has never mentioned a single thing, well, you could be the first one, you know? And that's something that I've taken on in my own life to say, well, I it's easy to complain, but am I being honest? Am I being vulnerable, am I sharing? And I was convicted about that a while back and took steps to get open and honest, even in my own small group, in my own church, to share some of the struggles I've had and some of the current temptations and struggles that I wrestle with. And it was hard and it was vulnerable, but it really in my own walk, it just kind of pushed me forward to say the church should be the place, and if it should be, then I need to take that step. I need to be one who's open and honest, and I think that will influence those that are around us. I love that in the church. I mean, the church is us. So we are the church. Actually, all of us are the church. So it's not just people out there. Yes, I love them. Well, hopefully some, you know, women listening to this and even men, you know, can be empowered. You know, sometimes you we just have to go first. And there's appropriate ways to do that. You can find the the right way, the right channel, you know, talk to your leadership. Maybe it's in your small group, but absolutely like we all could we could lead the way. If there's not something happening, don't just like leave it to your pastor. Yeah. Amen. Yeah. All right, well, let's move on. Sorry. My screen just did something. No change here. Technology's great. When I went down. I was like, oh, my gosh, all these windows are popping up. Hold on. No. Okay, there we go. That was super weird. I think it wants to reboot or. Like, right now. Update right now. Oh my gosh, my editor cut all that out for us. Okay. So let's let's move on to talk is your mom. And, you know, we have a lot of parents that listen to this podcast and, you know, moms and dads both raising daughters in this hyper sexual, hyper digital world. What advice do you have for them or wisdom to, you know, to really help raise a biblically sound? And, you know, woman, you know, because ultimately were charged with raising them to adults and, you know, there's just not a lot of great resources out there. But what have you found that's been effective? Yes. Well, my kids are still younger-ish. 14, 10, and then a little baby girl. So two boys, one little girl. So I'm, I'm already trembling, thinking of the future of, like, what? Technology are they gonna when they're older, you know. Yeah, but one thing that I have found so helpful, especially with my older two, is not waiting for some magical age to start talking about God's design for sexuality. There are age appropriate ways that we can decide. Are children in the truth to understanding God's good design for sexuality, for their body, their desires, their questions. As parents, we should be their number one resource. They should not have to rely on Google when they're old enough to have a phone, or getting information from their friends, or sneaking a peek at some magazine. They should be able to come to their parents. We should be the ones. But I think as parents it can be really scary. Like, how do I address this? How do I talk about this? But there are many resources online that are age appropriate for younger, you know, children even down to like younger kids, just in very basic forms, talking about God's design for your body and not being afraid to even name body parts, you know, to tell your little girl, you know she has a vagina or a little boy, it's a penis. And and it can feel almost like, oh, this feels uncomfortable. But we if we're awkward about it, how much more awkward are our kids going to be? They're never going to come to us if they feel any sense of weirdness. And so my encouragement to parents is the same thing that I've had to kind of get over is this is God's design. Let's reclaim it and let's normalize it to help our kids understand it in a beautiful and healthy way. Let's be proactive, not reactive. And as your kids get older, obviously the they think the resources you can go through can get more, in-depth. You can go through book studies, you know, once they get a little bit older. I recommend to mothers and daughters all of the time to go through“Sex, Purity, and the Longings of a Girl's Heart,” because it has a built in study guide at the back, questions that make it so easy for you to go through one chapter at a time. And if you, as a parent, are like, I just don't know what questions to ask or how to dig in, how do I, you know, break the ice on the topic of pornography? Well, a book study hours. There are others. I know you guys have stuff authentic intimacy is another great ministry. There are resources out there that we can utilize and we can use to guide our children and disciple them. And understanding God's good design, because, again, if they're not hearing it from us, then they are going to hear it from someone else. And it is most likely not going to be the beautiful version of sexuality that God lays out for us in Scripture. So my biggest encouragement is to be proactive. Don't just be reactive. Absolutely. Those are great, you know, steps that parents can take. And all of those things also help insulate our kids from the dangers of groomers and, you know, predators online and things once they do get online. So, I mean, you're not only teaching them the beauty of, you know, the way God designed sex and you know, their bodies and how to appreciate that, but you're also protecting them from danger, you know, online and and even in the real world. So I love that. And I think it's so important. And there are tons of great resources. You just have to know where to find them. So the church should be, you know, a great place to also seek out those resources. Covenant Eyes has some on our website. Authentic intimacy is a great resource as well for parents. And of course, your book sounds like a great fit for that. Like pre-teen teenage mom daughter kind of study. I love that idea. Well, we're coming to the end of today's episode. I want to make sure people can get connected with you because they probably have more questions, and they probably want to learn more about how they can get involved. So where can they go to get your books, listen to your podcast, or, you know, check out any of the other resources you guys have. Yeah, GirlDefined.com is where everything's that of course Amazon. And we have all of our books on there. We just finished“Made to Be She” was our sixth book. So we've got some good ones. We've got a book on love and relationships. Obviously sex and purity. Girl Defined was our initial original book talking about womanhood. In a more basic level. And then our most recent made to be she's kind of taking a deeper dive, geared toward, you know, a little bit older, maybe 2030s than just teens. But, I mean, any woman of any age I think would really benefit from it. If you're like, I just want to understand God's design. I know I'm believing lies. I'm not really sure where to go. Like, that can be a really great start. So follow us on Instagram. We'd love to hang out with you, chat with you. I'd love to continue this conversation. Answer any questions. That's it. Instagram GirlDefined we have YouTube GirlDefined. Just search GirlDefined and it'll all come up awesome. Well, great. We'll make sure we put the links in the show notes to you so that the listeners can easily find those. If they just happen to be driving at the moment and can't remember all that. So up. I know how it is. We're all the same. Yes. And multitasking is our one of our strong suits. Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you so much Kristen for being on the show today. And thank you for you and your sisters ministry. I think it's such a blessing. And, you know, just continue to get out there and share this great message of encouragement and hope to our women. They need that so desperately. So thank you again for joining us. Thanks for having me, Karen, and thank you for all the work you guys are doing at Covenant Eyes . I know we actually use y'all's program, y'all's filtering for my son's computer that he uses for school. And just a lot of your resources, your blog post, your podcast. So greatly appreciate the work you guys are doing. Keep it up. Thanks so much. Well, to all of our listeners out there, be sure to share this episode with your friends and family, and we'll see you next time on The Covenant Eyes Podcast. Take care. God bless.